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Old 05-06-2018, 07:53 AM   #781
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Sinn Fein have held the seat since its creation in 1997, so it isn't exactly ground lost for any one, well except for the citizens of West Tyrone of course, who won't be properly represented in either the local or national parliament.
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Old 05-06-2018, 07:59 AM   #782
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I was chatting with one of the Welsh boys at work last week. I asked him if he spoke much Welsh. "Not really, I learnt it at school, but nobody bothers with it." Then he spoke a short sentence in Welsh, I caught a word that obviously translated as "shit", so I asked him what he'd said. "School is a load of shit." Then he went on to say, "It's like any foreign language, only worth learning all the swear words."

So there you have it, straight from the mouth of a Welshman!
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Old 05-08-2018, 06:24 PM   #783
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Arlene-Foster-Dee-Stitt.jpgMay the 8th, the anniversary of the Loughall shoot out. Typically Sinn Fein leadership attends the memorial, which inflames the DUP. Curiously, as she condemns Sinn Fein for commemorating IRA terrorism, Arelene has no problem posing all smiles with UDA boss Dee Stitt.
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Old 05-08-2018, 07:10 PM   #784
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Has to be said, she's a minger!

Meanwhile, back in the real world, parents of deaf children have been laying in to members of Northern Irelands Assembly for lack of progress over power sharing. Northern Ireland does not have a sign languages act, or any sort of legislation that supports the accessing of language for deaf people and their families. There is no provision for teaching of British Sign Language in the provinces schools, and there are only just over 30 BSL translators to cover the whole country.

Whilst Stormont remains closed, and Westminster fails to govern properly in its place, this legislation cannot be made.

Obviously language can impact on a persons ability to access education, along with the cumulative effect that has on their career prospects further down the line.

Puts a petty squabble over a couple of dead languages in to context, doesn't it?
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Don't think.... FEEL!

We're Englishmen, and we came here, to rape your women and drink your beer.

I went back in time and voted for Hitler.


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Old 05-13-2018, 04:00 AM   #785
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From a BBC Northern Ireland web page report on the release of files relating to the 1922 Altnaveigh massacre of 6 Protestant civilians in Northern Ireland ordered by Republican "hero" Michael Collins in revenge for the killing of IRA soldiers:

"Attempts were made to cover-up details about the murder of six Protestants in County Armagh in June 1922 by the IRA, newly released files have shown.

Around 30 IRA men from County Louth crossed the border to attack the community of Altnaveigh, near Newry.

Five men and one woman were killed, and more than a dozen properties were also burned down or bombed.

Details were released by the Republic of Ireland's Military Service Pensions Collection.

The killings, that became known as the Altnaveigh Massacre, were one of the most controversial IRA attacks of the period.




Protestant communities were left in fear following the violence, which was seen by some as an attempt to ethnically cleanse the area.

Among those who were killed were John Heaslip and his teenage son Robert, and Thomas and Elizabeth Crozier, a couple who were said to have been targeted because they recognised the attackers.

The murders occurred following the signing of the Anglo-Irish Treaty but Michael Collins had ordered the continuation of covert actions in Northern Ireland.

The details are contained in newly released files which cover the claims for military pensions of several men who were there.

Reprisal attacks

According to Irish state broadcaster RTÉ, an IRA brigade report from the time has a section entitled "Altnaveigh shootings" but the details are left blank.

Other files simply refer to a "special job".

Nine men in total are named in the files as having participated.

One of the men involved, James Marron, said the unit was under orders to "burn every house and shoot every male".

It is believed that the murders were either carried out as a reprisal for the killings of local Catholics or of IRA men by B Specials, and according to Marron, Altnaveigh was chosen because it was a "stronghold of the B Force Murder Gang".


So perhaps there were no reprisals in the Republic of Ireland against loyalists, but Protestants in Northern Ireland certainly had reason to fear the Republic non the less.
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THE WESTCOUNTRY SHALL RISE AGAIN!

Yay! It's pink!

Don't think.... FEEL!

We're Englishmen, and we came here, to rape your women and drink your beer.

I went back in time and voted for Hitler.


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Old 05-13-2018, 10:10 AM   #786
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Northern Irelands Green Party leader, Steven Agnew, has hit out at members of Northern Irelands assembly saying that if they do not want power, it should be given to local councils.

He has made it quite clear that he blames Sinn Fein and the DUP for a lack of power sharing at Stormont, and that it would make sense to let local councils run the province instead.

It would certainly dilute the over-bearing influence of the two parties on politics in Ulster if budgets were administered, and policy made, at local authority level rather than national level. Giving a minority opposing political party power over the entire region is just stupid any way, and demonstrates a major flaw in the peace process.
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Don't think.... FEEL!

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Old 05-13-2018, 06:18 PM   #787
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FuckingRotter View Post
From a BBC Northern Ireland web page report on the release of files relating to the 1922 Altnaveigh massacre of 6 Protestant civilians in Northern Ireland ordered by Republican "hero" Michael Collins in revenge for the killing of IRA soldiers:

"Attempts were made to cover-up details about the murder of six Protestants in County Armagh in June 1922 by the IRA, newly released files have shown.

Around 30 IRA men from County Louth crossed the border to attack the community of Altnaveigh, near Newry.

Five men and one woman were killed, and more than a dozen properties were also burned down or bombed.

Details were released by the Republic of Ireland's Military Service Pensions Collection.

The killings, that became known as the Altnaveigh Massacre, were one of the most controversial IRA attacks of the period.




Protestant communities were left in fear following the violence, which was seen by some as an attempt to ethnically cleanse the area.

Among those who were killed were John Heaslip and his teenage son Robert, and Thomas and Elizabeth Crozier, a couple who were said to have been targeted because they recognised the attackers.

The murders occurred following the signing of the Anglo-Irish Treaty but Michael Collins had ordered the continuation of covert actions in Northern Ireland.

The details are contained in newly released files which cover the claims for military pensions of several men who were there.

Reprisal attacks

According to Irish state broadcaster RTÉ, an IRA brigade report from the time has a section entitled "Altnaveigh shootings" but the details are left blank.

Other files simply refer to a "special job".

Nine men in total are named in the files as having participated.

One of the men involved, James Marron, said the unit was under orders to "burn every house and shoot every male".

It is believed that the murders were either carried out as a reprisal for the killings of local Catholics or of IRA men by B Specials, and according to Marron, Altnaveigh was chosen because it was a "stronghold of the B Force Murder Gang".


So perhaps there were no reprisals in the Republic of Ireland against loyalists, but Protestants in Northern Ireland certainly had reason to fear the Republic non the less.
A somewhat faulty analogy. The question was would loyalists, or Protestants if you will, have suffered reprisals in an united Irish Republic. The action in question was a revenge attack for the killings of IRA volunteers by the B specials. In a united Ireland, no B specials, hence no revenge killings.

that said, no justification for killing innocent civilians. However if the men who were shot were B men, no sympathy here. Why a woman was killed, who knows? It was 96 years ago.
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Old 05-13-2018, 07:02 PM   #788
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A bit more. I have no problem believing that Collins gave that order. He was ruthless, even by IRA standards. Undeinably effective though. His simultaneous assassination of most British intelligence agents in Dublin crippled the crown information gathering. It also triggered the original Bloody Sunday, the Black and Tans drove armoured cars into Croke Park and opened fire on the crowd.
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Old 05-13-2018, 07:28 PM   #789
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The no outside link rule is a nuisance, unless you were able to find the story any way?

The article only describes the area as being a B Specials stronghold, not that any of the victims were members. Reading some of the killers descriptions suggests the victims were actually known to some of the squad Collins sent, and that is the reason the woman and her husband were killed - they were unlucky enough to witness the attack and would have been able to identify the attackers.
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Old 05-15-2018, 04:34 AM   #790
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I read somewhere that right up to the birth of the Provisional IRA, that the original IRA was run from the Republic and that's where strategy was decided and orders given from. When the Provisionals took over, the command switched to Northern Ireland and from then on it was run from that province.
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Old 05-15-2018, 04:48 PM   #791
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True Grant's. The primary purpose of the northern units prior to 1969 was to act as a sort of home guard to protect against periodic Orange pogroms. The failure of the Army Council to deliver any meaningful protection was one of the principal reasons for the split. I Ran Away was being painted on the walls all over the nationalist areas of the north.

Some southern volunteers did see active service during the troubles, but the main job of the IRA south of the border was maintaining arms dumps and safe houses for volunteers on the run.

During the early '60s the IRA drifted into Marxism. The theory being they could unite the w ok ring classes of both communities in common cause against their capitalist overlords. A rather simplistic approach that centuries of hate would be put aside to march hand in hand into the new Marxist utopia. And then there's the fact that communist atheism was tough sell in 1969, both on the Falls and the Shankhill.

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Old 05-19-2018, 08:46 AM   #792
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Any communism is still a tough sell.
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Old 05-20-2018, 11:52 AM   #793
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Recent evidence show the possibility of a nationalist/catholic majority as soon as 2021. While a majority of nationalist favor reunification , it's not an overwhelming majority by any means.

To win over moderate nationalists unionists face some tough choices. The bonfires, the marches, the cozy relationship with the UDA, defined as celebrating their heritage are deeply repugnant to even luke warm nationalists.

The trappings of the last century when they enjoyed a dictatorship of the majority have to go to convince nationalist they have a stake in preserving the union.
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Old 05-20-2018, 01:01 PM   #794
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So, as soon as three years. Provided the Good Friday Agreement holds, which is in doubt at present, given the EUs obstinacy over Brexit, and similar obstinacy keeping Stormont empty.

You also need to factor in immigration. Migrants don't have the entrenched sectarian loyalties that Ulster natives do. They came to live in the United Kingdom, and may well see their interests best served remaining there.

Not that it matters to me. I think I've already stated, we'd be well rid of Northern Ireland so long as we get out of the EU. I just hate the IRA and want to see them all suspended from their genitalia and beaten.
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Yay! It's pink!

Don't think.... FEEL!

We're Englishmen, and we came here, to rape your women and drink your beer.

I went back in time and voted for Hitler.


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