If I had a meat cleaver....

[pervipete]

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the socialists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Catholic.

Then they came for me,
and there was no one left to speak for me.

Martin Niemöller (14 January 1892 – 6 March 1984)

[LIDM99810]

Ok. I'm. A christian, I'm making that known now. I don't convert ppl, I don't look down on ppl, and I don't take the bible the old testament as current mode of behaviour. Christians thru out history caused a lboody bloodbath. It seems we've cleaned up our act nowadays.

If you precribe to jesus teaching, (the nt) nowhere does he condone violence. I still can't reconcile both old and new testaments, but I'm no bible scholar, so I'm not qualified, perhaps there's a damn good reason.

Basically, jesus is real to me, I follow his way he taught in the nt. Now I may be abusive lately on rb, that's cos I requently go off the rails, after something evil happened a few weeks ago, I decided to start being decent. For ever this time.

Ok, now where does islam come into this? I honestly can't speak for it, I've not read the koran, all I know of islam is ewhat I see reported on the news; the extremists, and how women are trated.

I wouldn't say I hate them, it makes me angry, but I feel hatred is a waste of energy better sepnt in other ways.

In australia, we have a blatant prejudice against islam, along with aborgiginies. We still have grassroots white supremacim here.

What is happening in the uk, I trust what fr says, as he has obviously studied the koran, and knows the soceital problems there.

[LIDM99810]

Ill add also I still struggle with my sexual inclinations, I don't know how to resolve all that yet.

[pervipete]

I'm in the UK too, and believe me not all Muslims are running around with meat cleavers going allah fucking ackbar, in fact a great deal of the Muslim's I know, and whose reading oft the Quoran I trust a hell of a lot more than his, are peaceful people who just want to live and worship in peace.

Its like the bible and all religious texts, people can interpret it as suits their own prejudices and thoughts.

[menace]

Jas, I'm not berating Christians here. I just take an issue with people who think living in another culture is some kind of an excursion to a fun park.

[LIDM99810]

Seems in all relgions bad ppl put an evil spin on holy texts to suit themselves.

I'm willing to believe that what you said then pete, cos I have zero knowledge or first hand experience with muslims as ordinary ppl.

I think those 2 men just used islam radicalism as an exuse to be mongrels.

[LIDM99810]

Originally Posted by menace

Jas, I'm not berating Christians here. I just take an issue with people who think living in another culture is some kind of an excursion to a fun park.

No no, I didn't think that at all. I jst firgured it was a good time to come clean here, and why I'm kinda being scarce around rape sites, tryna reconcile a few things about myself.

[LIDM99810]

Also just be aware you guys my meds affect my information uptake and cognitive function. It usually takes a few hrs for me to understand complex suituations, esp things like the views put here in this discussion. Ill prolly go away and think on it, and suddenley it will all click into place. Its a curse of mind altering drugs I need to take to keep well.

[pervipete]

No worries love

[menace]

Originally Posted by LIDM99810

No no, I didn't think that at all. I jst firgured it was a good time to come clean here, and why I'm kinda being scarce around rape sites, tryna reconcile a few things about myself.

Hm, don't think I can give any useful input there. I'm an atheist by conviction.

[jwham]

I will undoubtedly piss off the politically correct crowd by stating precisely what the Prophet Muhammad, was, and that is a pedophile, as is clearly stated in Tabari IX:128, look it up for yourself. Religion of all beliefs is bullshit, and none stinks more then Islam. People should stop blaming or claiming some God makes them do the things they do. It is hatred and ignorance that drives their motivations.

[Hailo]

Originally Posted by jwham

Religion of all beliefs is bullshit, and none stinks more then Islam. People should stop blaming or claiming some God makes them do the things they do. It is hatred and ignorance that drives their motivations.

And your statement above is not ignorant at all?!

[FuckingRotter]

What if the devil made them do it?

[FuckingRotter]

Copy cat attack in Paris anyone? Or did he dream it up sitting at a bus stop. Tell me now that extremists shouldn't be crushed so that normal people can pray in peace, and without fear? Or not as they might choose.

[FuckingRotter]

Three more arrests in London last night. The lone mutters dreaming it up at the bus stop eh? Well they do say you wait an eternity and three buses to paradise come at once. It's starting to look like one fuck of a queue at the bus stop.

[Hailo]

I am not pro for these idiots, I just don't like the thought that its not the extremists that are getting a bad name but the whole religion. Millions of innocent Muslim people are all being tarred under the same divvy brush as those twats.

[FuckingRotter]

And why shouldn't they be? Is there anyone here that truly believes God created the Earth in six days and rested on the seventh? Or that there is one true God, and Mohammed is his prophet? Or that Allah knows all that is seen and all that is yet to be revealed?

I really couldn't give a flying fuck for a persons right to worship when it flies in the face of all reason, and endangers the foundations of a society that we have built, that may not be perfect, but has moved on a lot from the heights of our Empire days. A country where everyone is entitled to an education, an education that is undermined by religious superstition. That alone is reason enough to close every mosque, church, temple and any other place of religious nonsense in this country.

No though! We're told we have to tolerate the unreasonable, the intolerable, that we live in an inclusive, multi-cultural society and we have to respect the beliefs of everyone.

The fuck do we! We live in a country that vaguely resembles a democracy, where the majority view is the one that wins the day, whether that view is palatable to some or not. People that hold fundamental creationist beliefs, and recognise the authority of a higher being for which there is no evidence except what was written in books by men that lived before science, are in the minority in this country. If they don't like that, they should go and find a country where such stupidity is acceptable:

[pervipete]

One, just cause someone's been arrested does not mean they are guilty, two, there are millions of Muslims out there, so a few being arrested does not make them all extremists.

I'm a Christian, sharing the same God as the Westboro Baptist Church, but that does not mean I share their 'God hates fags' views, just as I do not share the anti Gay marriage view with elements of the Church of England.

There will always been people who hijack things for their own agenda, just as the ignorant thugs that make up the EDL have hijacked this tragedy for their own ends, that is of trouble making. I know people like these, they're the same people bullying and causing trouble on a Saturday night.

And one final thing, have you noticed how many of these 'proud Englishmen and women' can't speak the language that well themselves, let alone write it down...

[FuckingRotter]

One, agreed, no it doesn't. The burden of proof is on the crown, as it should be. That alone is at odds with Islamic practice in some parts of the world.

Two, three million Muslims I think little miss Rooter wrote? Agreed, again. They don't need to be extremists. They just need to accept the law of Allah as given to Mohammed by the angel Gabriel and written down by him as he remembers it, then revealed to his followers bit by bit, slowly altering parts of it as he went along so that his followers could swallow it without choking. The law of Allah, men have dominance over women who should stay at home. Children should accept the authority of their parents. So we have arranged marriages, for ed marriage, honour killings as a consequence. These are not extremists, these are every day Muslims accepting the law of Allah, the tradition it has created, and placing it above the law of this country. Not every Muslim family, but enough of them that we should be concerned.

I knew a girl that lived in fear of her life, she had run away from home because she had a white, non-Muslim boyfriend, and didn't want to marry the boy her parents chose for her. She was 15 at the time. She left everything, her family, friends, boyfriend. She was so scared she wouldn't even tell him she was leaving, let alone where she was going. Her father was a teacher. A fucking teacher Pete! Can you get any more every day and respectable than that? He went to Mosque every Friday, his wife who had been to university, stayed at home and played house because that is what Allah commands. Both her brothers were in arranged marriages.

She was so afraid that she wouldn't even tell me where she came from. She was virtually the only Pakistani person in a very bigoted Somerset town and she said that was preferable to where she had run away from.

Originally Posted by pervipete

One, just cause someone's been arrested does not mean they are guilty, two, there are millions of Muslims out there, so a few being arrested does not make them all extremists.

[FuckingRotter]

Oh, and she was fit a fuck as well. I'd have done her!