I'm feeling torn.

[Freydicat]

I haven't been on here much lately.
That's because several weeks ago, my girlfriend was raped. Last week we found out that she was pregnant as a result, so today she had an abortion. I just have to say, even if it's a bit off the topic, that anyone who harasses people going into abortion clinics, should be beat.

I know that there's a difference between the real thing and fantasy, but I feel like I'm betraying her because I still have the same fantasies. I know people are probably going to say that I'm not, but that's just the way I feel.

[Ragman]

First let me say how sorry i am to hear about your circumstances.

I Understand how you are feeling, i was in a similar situation a couple years back. And while its easy to say that "hey your fantasies are just that.. fantasies!! and they have nothing to do with real rape!" the reality is not always that easy.

The lady i was with had been raped years before I met her, i had spoken to her about my fantasies before she had revealed the truth to me, needless to say I felt pretty bad about bringing up the topic again.

I can't offer a lot of advice to you, Except to say that Sexual fantasies at this time are probably less important than providng comfort for your lady in her hour of need. my heart goes out to you. Just remember there are people here who might be able to offer a different possibly even helpful perspective, don't give up on us yet.

[littlesub20]

That is awful. I know the feeling. The aloneness. But murdering a child isn't right. Abortion clinics should be burnt down and the peopl who go to them should have their cunts sewn shut.
You can call me a heartless cunt if you want, but this is free speech. Just like you think I should "be beaten" because I believe abortion clinics are just murder clinics for the idiots who think a baby is disposable. Fuck them.

I sympathize. I do. But I don't feel the least bit bad for her if she's gonna make an ugly situation more ugly by murdering a kid. Bring on the hate mail, people.

[Joanna]

Originally Posted by Freydicat

I haven't been on here much lately.
That's because several weeks ago, my girlfriend was raped. Last week we found out that she was pregnant as a result, so today she had an abortion. I just have to say, even if it's a bit off the topic, that anyone who harasses people going into abortion clinics, should be beat.

I know that there's a difference between the real thing and fantasy, but I feel like I'm betraying her because I still have the same fantasies. I know people are probably going to say that I'm not, but that's just the way I feel.

its very understandable that you would feel that way I guess the same counts with any fantsiy were the reality is ugly and evil (war violence ect)

[Freydicat]

Originally Posted by littlesub20

That is awful. I know the feeling. The aloneness. But murdering a child isn't right. Abortion clinics should be burnt down and the peopl who go to them should have their cunts sewn shut.
You can call me a heartless cunt if you want, but this is free speech. Just like you think I should "be beaten" because I believe abortion clinics are just murder clinics for the idiots who think a baby is disposable. Fuck them.

I sympathize. I do. But I don't feel the least bit bad for her if she's gonna make an ugly situation more ugly by murdering a kid. Bring on the hate mail, people.

Such a shame for your argument that no one was murdering anyone.
It's so sad that your thoughts on someone who has gone through so much pain already, is to subject them to more pain.

[Janav]

Originally Posted by Freydicat

Such a shame for your argument that no one was murdering anyone.
It's so sad that your thoughts on someone who has gone through so much pain already, is to subject them to more pain.

People who follow extremist views of a religion that subscribes to monoteism in combination with convertionalism and non-tolerance even towards people of different faiths (or different strains of their own faith) are rather sad and pathetic people. They have always been, and they will always be. The best thing to do when they start gobbling about issues like these is ignore them. To me, these people are on the same niveau of value as trash. Humanitarian trash, but trash nontheless . Like any trash, they should to be disposed of.

A womans body is her own, and until said fetus is set into the world through birthing, i do not view it as a child. As such, the continued stable life of the mother/woman holds a higher position of importance than the possible life of a fetus. In comparison to the life of a woman, a fetus is a disposable possibility of life. Life in itself is sacred, but i do not view a fetus as life until birth.

Originally Posted by littlesub20

That is awful. I know the feeling. The aloneness. But murdering a child isn't right. Abortion clinics should be burnt down and the peopl who go to them should have their cunts sewn shut.
You can call me a heartless cunt if you want, but this is free speech. Just like you think I should "be beaten" because I believe abortion clinics are just murder clinics for the idiots who think a baby is disposable. Fuck them.

I sympathize. I do. But I don't feel the least bit bad for her if she's gonna make an ugly situation more ugly by murdering a kid. Bring on the hate mail, people.

I have to agree with Freydicat that now is not the time to bring views on abortion clinics, although he mentions about that " that anyone who harasses people going into abortion clinics, should be be beat" which would annoy some especially as your three and half months pregnant yourself....... he and his partner are obviously angry upset and traumatized by the events and he is writing from anger....


and can i suggest to everyone else not to turn this into a discussion on abortion given the situation Fredyicat has found himself in, abortion is not the main reason behind his post and this thread should not be hi-jacked and turned into one.

[littlesub20]

Freydi brought it up when she said that people need to be beat who disagree with it.
Well, too bad. Its my right. And you can call me "trash" if you want. I realize liberalism is a mental disorder...
Also, I HOPE you realize that by calling me "trash", that's ironic. Cause guess where that innocent remains of the beginning of a beautiful child ended up? Ha. The TRASH. Yeah, bring it on.
Like I said, I sympathize with how the child was conceived, but I don't give one damn about her "pain" if she murdered a child in the process.

[HYMENBUSTER]

well there is going to be no conclusion of this discussion let's be honest about it...I would suggest moving any discussion of the abortion issue to the Rowdy Room, it is a very difficult and emotional issue as we all can see...I'm sorry for what happened to fredyicat's girl but also Janav clearly implied that those who are in his view "intolerant" need to "be disposed of"...which smacks of Fascism so maybe a mod could move the abortion segment to the rowdy room and we can focus on helping fedyicat deal with her moral dilemma relating to rape fantasy

[Joanna]

Originally Posted by littlesub20

Freydi brought it up when she said that people need to be beat who disagree with it.
Well, too bad. Its my right. And you can call me "trash" if you want. I realize liberalism is a mental disorder...
Also, I HOPE you realize that by calling me "trash", that's ironic. Cause guess where that innocent remains of the beginning of a beautiful child ended up? Ha. The TRASH. Yeah, bring it on.
Like I said, I sympathize with how the child was conceived, but I don't give one damn about her "pain" if she murdered a child in the process.

As it goes I agree with you about abortion but there is a time and place for everything and this thread is more about the horrible situation that caused the abortion rather than about abortion.

Though you do have a point maybe its freydicats fault for including the pro abortion comments in the first place if they didn't want anti abortion comments made then it would have been better if they had left out the antagonistic comments about the abortion issue in the first place and just concentrated on the main issue.

but damn for a little sub your a hella lot unsubmissive jk

[HYMENBUSTER]

and don't worry I'll be sure to give lil sub anice hard anal raping for you guys...actually it's for me! would you like some too joanna?

[MADDOGMCMANAMAN]

i thought freydicat was a girl ??

[Freydicat]

Originally Posted by littlesub20

Freydi brought it up when she said that people need to be beat who disagree with it.
Well, too bad. Its my right. And you can call me "trash" if you want. I realize liberalism is a mental disorder...
Also, I HOPE you realize that by calling me "trash", that's ironic. Cause guess where that innocent remains of the beginning of a beautiful child ended up? Ha. The TRASH. Yeah, bring it on.
Like I said, I sympathize with how the child was conceived, but I don't give one damn about her "pain" if she murdered a child in the process.

One problem with your argument (again) is that there is no murder here.
You say 'liberalism' (even though the Liberals in Australia are the Conservative party) is a mental disorder, when recent studies are showing that the brains of Conservatives and Progressives are wired differently. From everything I've seen in politics here in Australia as well as in the US, that wiring difference is that Conservatives care only for themselves whereas Progressives care for others as well if not more than themselves. How else can you put the word pain in quotes?

Originally Posted by MADDOGMCMANAMAN

i thought freydicat was a girl ??

She is.

[dadysgirl87]

Freydicat, don't even argue with her, she's ignorant for being negative after such a terrible thing happened to u and ur girlfriend. This isn't supposed to be about the rights and wrongs of abortion, its about freydicats feelings towards her fantasies, which I think she should refrain from doing w/ her gf for a while until she starts feeling better. Also, "fantasizing" and "role-playing" isn't wrong, but actual rape is.

[AWDracer]

Originally Posted by littlesub20

That is awful. I know the feeling. The aloneness. But murdering a child isn't right. Abortion clinics should be burnt down and the peopl who go to them should have their cunts sewn shut.
You can call me a heartless cunt if you want, but this is free speech. Just like you think I should "be beaten" because I believe abortion clinics are just murder clinics for the idiots who think a baby is disposable. Fuck them.

I sympathize. I do. But I don't feel the least bit bad for her if she's gonna make an ugly situation more ugly by murdering a kid. Bring on the hate mail, people.

It's your opinion but I respectfully disagree.

I can see that you're pro-life; I am too, in the sense that innocent people should not be killed. I'm not necessarily in favour of abortions, but I do not see a harm in doing so when the two couples have thoroughly thought this process; the implications etc etc. (Applies for non-consensual and consensual sex alike). I just don't like the fact that your supposed self-righteousness just happens to overreach into other people's freedoms and rights. While we're at that, why not promote Christianity over other religions as well because the Bible said... "God created the Heaven and the Earth..."? Because it's wrong to do so.

According to your post, you are asking her to keep the child of a rapist? Not only does that SOUND abhorrent, it also effectively cripples what future she had planned. To keep the child, she and her boyfriend will have to raise funds to do it. Failure to do so will result in the child being "mistreated" (by that I don't mean abused, I mean he/she will NOT be getting the minimum treatment and care for a developing healthy baby). Assuming they are at least 18 years old, where are you going to find enough money to raise and take care of YOURSELVES as a couple AND the baby? I haven't even gotten started on what she had planned for HERSELF. Is this also fair for the boyfriend who's girlfriend was raped? If she was forced into keeping this baby, the boyfriend more than likely will feel a moral sense of duty to stay with her. Again, his future will be thrown off course with the presence of a child. While I am concerned about the couple, I am also concerned with the child as well, and how he/she will be taken care of in the future. When the foundation isn't stable for a child, why must people force others to keep a baby that they are not ready to accept? You say abortion clinics need to be burned down, I say your kind of thinkers need to be re-educated and be more considerate.

I am laying down the cards nice and clearly so that you can perhaps benefit:

- Because of people like you who give people hard time about abortions, even in times of rape, you are forcing her to accept a baby she is not ready for. Who will be paying for the expenses? You will? Your kinds of people? If there is a loud agreement that this will be the case, I will stay silent on this issue. But, it's your kind of "self-righteous" thought that over-reach into other people's freedoms and rights. Your expectation that she should just "suck it up" illustrates your arrogance.

- The girl and presumably the boy as well will have little to no chance of her successful future, if she had originally planned if forced to accept the baby. How can she focus on her career when she has a kid to take care of? It doesn't matter if she was a straight A student, her future as a doctor just got thrown out the window. Presently, as she and the boyfriend are young, they likely make just enough for themselves AND not the child. Even if they pool their money together, it will not be sufficient to pay for all the funds for everyone. However if both have not a job, where do you get the money? Stealing? Drugs?

Added to that, there's the mental factor: unless she personally consents to keeping the child, there is no need to keep a reminder of a horrific incident. She will never be the same in either case. If she keeps the child, she'll have a child at such a young age that would look embarassing among her peers. Would she be thought a dumb promiscuous slut? Abortion clears her name privately. Even if she told everyone she was raped, there would be sympathetic and disrespectful people just laughing at her incident. Why should she be subjugated by this treatment?

It's not liberalism you're advocating Sub. Liberalism I would think advocates the freedoms of people more. You are doing the opposite.

I rest my case.

[Freydicat]

Just mentioning again.. All woman here...

[littlesub20]

Ever hear of adoption? My best friend is a product of brutal rape. His mother had every right to abort. But she gave life to one of the greatest and caring people ever. He was adopted. Because she knew that from a hideous ugly act (the rape) that something beautiful and pure came from the relationship. (My friend being born)
He was adopted out to a great family.
I am mooooooore than willing to pay my tax dollars to women who need it for deliveries of children. I believe everyone deserves proper medical care. And even further more for women who are strong and unselfish enough to carry a child no matter how the circumstances played out for it to be conceived.
Because the child is a separate being from the rapist. Its a beautiful and innocent bystander.
So, I'm not saying freydi and her gf (or ANY couple for that matter) have to keep the child, but give the child a fighting chance at a good life. Oh wait! Nope! Its at the city dump now... my bad.
Night, everyone.

[Freydicat]

Doctor. Psychiatrist. Her family. Her. Me. We all agreed it was the best thing to do.
Since she was attacked, she's been horribly depressed and tried to hurt herself. We all felt that she was at risk mentally and physically if the pregnancy continued.
It's hard for a fetus to survive if the mother is dead. And anyone saying it's worth the risk is heartless.

[littlesub20]

Oooooh boo fuckin whooo.
Sorry, but that whole "they were depressed they had no self control" bullshit doesn't fly.
We've all been depressed. I've been depressed. I've been raped. And I ALWAYS had a choice to hurt myself or not. Whether or not I did, it was a CHOICE. And if the gf is gonna be selfish enough to hurt herself with an inocent baby inside her and she chooses to die and take the baby out with her... then yeah, I DON'T CARE. Because I'd rather a baby killer gone than a baby. But if the baby is gonna die either way, then hey... might as well kill two birds with one stone, right? Heh. Yeah, call me heartless.
Listen... I'd have not even stated my opinion on abortion in this thread if you hadn't put that people who state their opinion on abortion being wrong need to be beaten...
I'd have just given my sympathies and prayers, but reading that one part turned the tables.
So, again... call me heartless. Its all good to me.

[AWDracer]

Originally Posted by littlesub20

Ever hear of adoption? My best friend is a product of brutal rape. His mother had every right to abort. But she gave life to one of the greatest and caring people ever. He was adopted. Because she knew that from a hideous ugly act (the rape) that something beautiful and pure came from the relationship. (My friend being born)
He was adopted out to a great family.
I am mooooooore than willing to pay my tax dollars to women who need it for deliveries of children. I believe everyone deserves proper medical care. And even further more for women who are strong and unselfish enough to carry a child no matter how the circumstances played out for it to be conceived.
Because the child is a separate being from the rapist. Its a beautiful and innocent bystander.
So, I'm not saying freydi and her gf (or ANY couple for that matter) have to keep the child, but give the child a fighting chance at a good life. Oh wait! Nope! Its at the city dump now... my bad.
Night, everyone.

Good for your friend. Good that she's happy. That's her prize and her problem. That's her gift and her curse. And that's the truth.

Tax dollars aren't good enough. Just because you pay a little for your tax, you expect you can help EVERYONE in this situation? My question was, since you were so into pro-life and practically forcing people into keeping a baby they can't keep, can you PERSONALLY finance them and other women? If you're that rich I will honestly be silent on this issue, but I'm going to take a liberal stance and say you won't be able to, therefore you have no say over what people should or shouldn't do.

Well you can be as self-righteous as you want, and that's an admirable trait, and be the most unselfish person in the world but somebody has to pay the price and that would be YOU. The injustice is on you. Keeping the child at a time when you're not ready to give birth to kids means that you'll be paying the price - the price of actually going through the pain...only to give it up to an adoption agency where you'll likely never see him/her again, the responsibility or that "sense" of responsibility whether the child lives or dies, the physical price of your body being warped out of normalcy, the emotional price. I could go on and on and on. Even though YOU may be unselfish, you're selfish in the sense for bringing a child into a world where you're not able to support the child. If you're willing to pay that price, go right ahead; a lot of people don't so please give them their freedom to choose for themselves what's right for them.

You haven't addressed the implications of actually sustaining the child. Having a child is not like buying a toy from a store and deciding to keep it. There is a very heavy maintenance and if you're not willing/capable of doing it, there is absolutely no point in bringing a child for the sake of life because in the end, you'd probably won't be a good parent and that hurts the child, even though you may have the best of intentions.

I don't buy the pro-life arguments at all. Nope. Guess it's the city dump then. By the way, I didn't say abortion was a good thing but in my opinion, abortion before the baby is born is better than giving birth to a child and FUCKING throwing it off a bridge, leaving it to die in the forest and/or abandoning it under a flight of stairs. So much for that life right? And what happens to the kids? They don't have fucking parents. Those parents should have aborted before committing cold blooded murder. How many babies are there out there that are found wrapped in a blanket dead? How many of them are traced back to the mother?

So whoop-dee-doo, they give birth to a child and throw them off a bridge or leave them in a forest to rot literally, they will be innocent of murder because they gave life!